Good / Bad Lease Deal

[v_traveller]

What do you guys think? At least I have choices and I think I am getting a respectable deal.

As you might expect, I think you should go for it! Kudos on annoying the dealerships; the one that you choose will only remember that they got your business, so it's all good.

I vote Oxford White with leather at the local dealer. You see the same damn heat as I do here in the Santa Clarita Valley, so for us white with a light colored interior is almost a necessity in an EV to minimize A/C usage. And $20/mo for leather is great... I went back and forth between dealers on my Volt quest last month, tried to get leather, but in the end I would have had to pay at least an extra $60/mo for it. So I settled for cloth. But my FFE has leather, and I drive that baby more, so I'm happy.

Let us know what you decide!

 

[v_traveller]

As much as I prefer leasing, that $6K off on a purchase works much better for me since I drive a lot of miles...

Miles aren't really an issue with most electric cars. Even if you averaged 90 miles, it would mean wherever you go, you'd have to stop and wait 4+ hours to charge it up to get more than that. Most likely you're driving under 100 miles a day on these cars. It's not like a gas car where you'd drive 300 miles, fill it up, drive another 300 miles, then come back home.

The FFE and most of these under 100 mile averages pretty much guarantees you're limited.

Perhaps I should clarify... I drive a lot of miles... 18,000 miles/year just on commuting 80+ miles/day to/from work (yes, I top off at a workplace EVSE). With the $6K purchase-only rebate, I'd be way better off buying vs. paying for a high-mileage lease. I made the mistake of taking a 12K miles/year lease thinking that I'd only use the FFE three days/week... boy was I wrong. I became addicted to the HOV Lane /EV Driving experience and put 17,000 miles on my FFE in less than a year.

Knowing that I would never shake the addiction, I was disgusted at the thought of paying Ford $0.20/mi at lease end (over $3K!). So now I'm paying $0.28/mi to lease a Volt instead. I can now tolerate letting my beloved FFE sit for 2 days out of every work week. Others have made the same mistake as I did, and ended up buying another plug-in to share the workload.

Edit: One more thing, pjam3... I said this before on one of your first posts, and I'll say it again... I truly admire your courage. Where the rest of us are early adopters, you are a pioneer. I hope this sorry infrastructure catches up to you sooner than later. Hang in there.

 

[pjam3]

As much as I prefer leasing, that $6K off on a purchase works much better for me since I drive a lot of miles...

Miles aren't really an issue with most electric cars. Even if you averaged 90 miles, it would mean wherever you go, you'd have to stop and wait 4+ hours to charge it up to get more than that. Most likely you're driving under 100 miles a day on these cars. It's not like a gas car where you'd drive 300 miles, fill it up, drive another 300 miles, then come back home.

The FFE and most of these under 100 mile averages pretty much guarantees you're limited.

Perhaps I should clarify... I drive a lot of miles... 18,000 miles/year just on commuting 80+ miles/day to/from work (yes, I top off at a workplace EVSE). With the $6K purchase-only rebate, I'd be way better off buying vs. paying for a high-mileage lease. I made the mistake of taking a 12K miles/year lease thinking that I'd only use the FFE three days/week... boy was I wrong. I became addicted to the HOV Lane /EV Driving experience and put 17,000 miles on my FFE in less than a year.

Knowing that I would never shake the addiction, I was disgusted at the thought of paying Ford $0.20/mi at lease end (over $3K!). So now I'm paying $0.28/mi to lease a Volt instead. I can now tolerate letting my beloved FFE sit for 2 days out of every work week. Others have made the same mistake as I did, and ended up buying another plug-in to share the workload.

Edit: One more thing, pjam3... I said this before on one of your first posts, and I'll say it again... I truly admire your courage. Where the rest of us are early adopters, you are a pioneer. I hope this sorry infrastructure catches up to you sooner than later. Hang in there.

I've actually been looking at the BMW i3 with extender, but not sure if it's worth the money. It's an interesting concept, but I want to replace my X5 SUV, but I'd rather stick with some combo of Electric and an extender. I have two kids and we like to go exploring and so on. We used to do that stuff all the time in the x5. But it sucks on gas. But its also a 9 year old SUV and i throw xmas tress on top of it, I put rafts, i have a tent in the back and so on. So it's more my go camping in the mountains and drive up dirt roads kind of truck. But it's gotten to the point of needing to spend like 6K to fix a few things and I"m just not sure if it's worth it to be spending thousands to fix up on top of the fact it just sucks as far as gas miles.

I was going to trade that in for the FFE, but I just decided to keep it and add the FFE to the mix. And being in my situation, I would have been screwed a few times without it.

Anyway, I have looked at the Energi, C-Max, Volt, Leaf, Prius hybrid plug-in and to me those cars are just compliance. The Volt is the best out of the mix in Electric, the others are the 10-20 miles on electric and spend an additional $10K on the car. The biggest problem though is the space. I had to buy some small crappy stroller to fit into my FFE. The Energi is even worse as I couldn't even fit the new stroller. And grocery shopping becomes one of those, only buy 2 bags and make them fit.

The Tesla Model S is a beautiful car and has tons of space. Space up front, space up back(even a 3rd seat option), but a $100K car just made no sense to me. It seemed like a waste of money. If I got a huge bonus this year, maybe, but it's been one of those years where the company didn't do as expected and we didn't get big bonuses. But even with that, it's just not worth it to me to spend $100K on a car that while great, is still new. I leased the FFE, so in 3 years, I can upgrade to the latest and greatest or buy some other car if I wanted to. And I expect in 3 years the Electric cars or Fuel Cell cars will be far better than they are today. You would hope. So buying a $100K car that might be great now, but behind the times in 3 years, is not really what I want.

Electric cars are like cell phones and tablets. They might work, but a 3 year old tablet or phone is far inferior to the latest and greatest models. And it's far easier to upgrade on some $500 phone or tablet compared to a $100K car. That's why I picked the FFE.

But yeah, I did look at the Toyota Rav4 Electric online and in reviews, but I haven't actually seen any and don't know anybody that has one to look at. But it would make more sense because it is an SUV and would be the get up and go vehicle if it could get like 200+ miles. But I'll still look.

I will say this though, I have about 1000 miles on my FFE and I bought it around Thanksgiving. And I haven't had to buy gas in my X5 in over a month as I don't use it that often.

 

[jmueller065]

Electric cars are like cell phones and tablets. They might work, but a 3 year old tablet or phone is far inferior to the latest and greatest models. And it's far easier to upgrade on some $500 phone or tablet compared to a $100K car. That's why I picked the FFE.

I'm not so sure about that: Automotive technology doesn't move that fast. In 3 years we might see cars with a more range (150-200 miles tops) but thats about it. There won't be any leaps & bounds of technology (well ok Sync running on QNX will be out.. LOL). Even today cellphones aren't advancing as fast as they used to: just look at the recent Galaxy S5 announcement that landed with a thud.


Green Car Reports has a great article about how to work with Home Ownership Associations at condo's to get them to install charging stations:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1090540_home-owner-associations-electric-cars-how-to-make-it-work-advice-from-a-pro

 

[twscrap]

Not true. Since jwilson165 was nice enough to post the dealer, I actually called them to see if it was true and if they could do it again. The answer was yes, and maybe. They didn't have any 2013's on the lot, but there were two left in MA extended inventory. Slightly different configuration cars, but was quoted $124 + sales tax.

Interesting, did you jump on it?

I tried to, but the car I was interested in already had a deposit on it. Leveraged the offer for a deal here in CT for $700 down $183/month including taxes, which is only slightly more than $124 originally quoted.

michael - i certainly will! the lease has changed slightly since my first post. during the paperwork, we were expected to pay ~$600 up front in "aquisition fees". since then, that money has been returned and added to our monthly payments, bringing the total to $122. so we're paying the same amount, just in a different way. i will do my best to provide some backup. i really love the car too. and i can't say enough about the dealer - Stoneham Ford in Stoneham MA. family owned, excellent buying experience. this is the third car we've purchased in the past year and their service was the best by FAR.

No one got one for $103 a month, that was baloney.

Not true. Since jwilson165 was nice enough to post the dealer, I actually called them to see if it was true and if they could do it again. The answer was yes, and maybe. They didn't have any 2013's on the lot, but there were two left in MA extended inventory. Slightly different configuration cars, but was quoted $124 + sales tax.

The posts by jwilson165 and twscrap seem too good to be true, so I called Stoneham Ford in Massachussets. They quoted me $2,700 down and $259 per month.

I am currently looking to buy or lease a FFE. If either of you have tips on how to get this amazing deal (proof that it is real, would be nice too), please post them to the forum.

jwilson165, it would also be nice if you clarified the trade-in part of your deal.

Thanks!

The deal is only for 2013s - the numbers that you've quoted would seem to be for a 2014.

 

[Lithium]

I believe, In MA, you do not pay sales tax on the rebates both from ford and the fed rebate. In my case, in NY, 8.625% it adds $2400 to the lease. That makes quite a difference on your payment over 36mths.
H

 

[socal]

Well - here is my latest lease offer - I was planning to purchase but they just called tonight and this deal looks pretty good without having to put out any cash.

Tri Coat Platinum with leather
MSRP $37685

The lease deal is 0 down - $300/month including taxes and registration with 12K miles - I just have to sign the deal by tomorrow. I have never leased before - anything we should watch out for in the paperwork - hidden fees they might try to add on? Plus I will get $2500 back from CA - making this cost about $230/month - which is what I will be saving in gas - so basically an even swap cost wise but I get a new car.

 

[v_traveller]

Well - here is my latest lease offer - I was planning to purchase but they just called tonight and this deal looks pretty good without having to put out any cash.

Tri Coat Platinum with leather
MSRP $37685

The lease deal is 0 down - $300/month including taxes and registration with 12K miles - I just have to sign the deal by tomorrow. I have never leased before - anything we should watch out for in the paperwork - hidden fees they might try to add on? Plus I will get $2500 back from CA - making this cost about $230/month - which is what I will be saving in gas - so basically an even swap cost wise but I get a new car.

That's awesome for a fully loaded FFE. I'd be down on that tonight before they change their mind. Kudos to the dealer for figuring out how to book a sale on what might be their slowest day of the year - it's gonna be raining cats and dogs tomorrow!

Like any other car deal, buy or lease, I'd just say no to everything they might try to add in the finance office (paint protector, tire insurance, etc). And this should end up in you giving them exactly $0 tomorrow, otherwise the Costco deal will do you better.

On the Ford Credit lease agreement (assuming they haven't changed the form since last Feb), in the "Due at Lease Signing or Delivery" box, Item 6c "Amount to be paid in cash" should be zero.

In the next box below, item 7k "Total monthly payment" should be $300.00. If it's off by a buck or two one way or another, I'd give them a break.

Item 7L "Lease term in months" should be 36.

Box 2 at the top of the form pretty much summarizes the monthly payments, but it might freak you out since it looks like you have to give them 36 payments. Since your first payment is due at drive-off, and you have $0 drive-off, you really only have 35 payments.

Hope this helps... and hope to hear from you tomorrow!

Oh, one more thing... How close is that to the Inland Empire? Maybe cwcabuhat could talk to them after you close your deal.

 

[cwcabuhat]

Well - here is my latest lease offer - I was planning to purchase but they just called tonight and this deal looks pretty good without having to put out any cash.

Tri Coat Platinum with leather
MSRP $37685

The lease deal is 0 down - $300/month including taxes and registration with 12K miles - I just have to sign the deal by tomorrow. I have never leased before - anything we should watch out for in the paperwork - hidden fees they might try to add on? Plus I will get $2500 back from CA - making this cost about $230/month - which is what I will be saving in gas - so basically an even swap cost wise but I get a new car.

That's awesome for a fully loaded FFE. I'd be down on that tonight before they change their mind. Kudos to the dealer for figuring out how to book a sale on what might be their slowest day of the year - it's gonna be raining cats and dogs tomorrow!

Like any other car deal, buy or lease, I'd just say no to everything they might try to add in the finance office (paint protector, tire insurance, etc). And this should end up in you giving them exactly $0 tomorrow, otherwise the Costco deal will do you better.

On the Ford Credit lease agreement (assuming they haven't changed the form since last Feb), in the "Due at Lease Signing or Delivery" box, Item 6c "Amount to be paid in cash" should be zero.

In the next box below, item 7k "Total monthly payment" should be $300.00. If it's off by a buck or two one way or another, I'd give them a break.

Item 7L "Lease term in months" should be 36.

Box 2 at the top of the form pretty much summarizes the monthly payments, but it might freak you out since it looks like you have to give them 36 payments. Since your first payment is due at drive-off, and you have $0 drive-off, you really only have 35 payments.

Hope this helps... and hope to hear from you tomorrow!

Oh, one more thing... How close is that to the Inland Empire? Maybe cwcabuhat could talk to them after you close your deal.

Ah! One hour too late. I "finalized" my lease yesterday just before this post went up. Finalized in quotes because the car doesn't arrive until Monday. I guess I could go back and kick a few more chairs around but I'm pretty happy with my experience with the dealer and the deal we ended up with.

Oxford white with leather and $1000 down at $280/month including tax.

Actually if I am doing my math right, and assuming that socal has to make 36 payments at $300, we came out even at the end of 3 years. I am just not getting the fancy paint job.

socal-- I am getting mine at Fritts Ford in Riverside and really had a good pressure free experience there. If you don't live too far from there, it probably wouldn't hurt to see if one other dealership can beat that lease offer.

 

[v_traveller]

Ah! One hour too late. I "finalized" my lease yesterday just before this post went up. Finalized in quotes because the car doesn't arrive until Monday. I guess I could go back and kick a few more chairs around but I'm pretty happy with my experience with the dealer and the deal we ended up with.

Oxford white with leather and $1000 down at $280/month including tax.

Actually if I am doing my math right, and assuming that socal has to make 36 payments at $300, we came out even at the end of 3 years. I am just not getting the fancy paint job.

socal-- I am getting mine at Fritts Ford in Riverside and really had a good pressure free experience there. If you don't live too far from there, it probably wouldn't hurt to see if one other dealership can beat that lease offer.

Wait, now you're at $280/mo?! Thought you were at $290... Teach me, Obi-wan. Clearly I concede too soon.

Your math is almost correct... socal will have 35 payments. That's still well within spitting range. Congratulations on a great deal!

 

[cwcabuhat]

Wait, now you're at $280/mo?! Thought you were at $290... Teach me, Obi-wan. Clearly I concede too soon.

Your math is almost correct... socal will have 35 payments. That's still well within spitting range. Congratulations on a great deal!

It wasn't hard at all actually. I just started saying to them that there was another dealership that is offering the same down and monthly payment but that the car was available now and wouldn't have to wait for it. Before I was finished with the sentence the sales manager asked if I would be willing to wait if he made my payment $280.

Now I just have to wait for it to get here. Luckily I got a call from the dealership telling me that the car is now expected to arrive on Monday instead of Friday. Can't wait. I'll be going through the "Owners" side of this forum for some tips and tricks soon.

 

[socal]

We just drove home our new Platinum White FFE with leather -we ended up getting the deal they promised and when we were finalizing papers in finance was surprised to hear that we could still get the Federal Tax Credit - though we leased it...She said the $10,750 was a rebate from Ford and that I did not sign away my rights to claim a Federal tax credit. Is this true? You bet I am going to try to claim it - but thought that Ford was with the lease deal...If I do get the $7500 federal and $2500 state - then I am almost getting the car for Free. This doesn't seem right. Has anyone else been able to claim the federal credit on their lease deal?

 

[WattsUp]

We just drove home our new Platinum White FFE with leather -we ended up getting the deal they promised and when we were finalizing papers in finance was surprised to hear that we could still get the Federal Tax Credit - though we leased it...She said the $10,750 was a rebate from Ford and that I did not sign away my rights to claim a Federal tax credit. Is this true? You bet I am going to try to claim it - but thought that Ford was with the lease deal...If I do get the $7500 federal and $2500 state - then I am almost getting the car for Free. This doesn't seem right. Has anyone else been able to claim the federal credit on their lease deal?

Congratulations on your lease. You're going to love your FFE.

But, umm, yeah no... unfortunately that person was misinformed. You are NOT entitled to the federal tax credit. Only the owner of the car can claim the tax credit. As a lessee, the owner of your vehicle is actually Ford, not you. That said, some or all of the $7,500 credit which Ford will receive helps finance the $10,750 rebate you got, so you did get some benefit.

Keep in mind that, when you claim the federal EV credit, you're signing (when you sign your tax return) that you are the original purchaser and owner of the vehicle (which you are neither, you're just leasing it) and are not knowingly filing your federal taxes incorrectly (which you would be). So, go ahead and sign your name to all that, if you like. :|

You are entitled to the California state EV rebate. That is available to all those who purchase or lease an EV.

Here's some information about the federal tax credit:
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/taxevb.shtml

Here's some information about the California rebate:
http://energycenter.org/clean-vehicle-rebate-project

 

[Gigi]

Congratulations! Hope you love your FFE as much as I love ours.

Ditto what WattsUp wrote about the tax credit.

The finance person where I bought our FFE didn't know diddly about tax credits and said the same thing as yours. I directed him to the state website that described the various tax credits for vehicles with different sized batteries and which credits applied to leases and which to purchases. He had not seen the site before.

 

[v_traveller]

Way to go, socal! It takes about 6 weeks to get the California CVRP rebate, might want to take care of that this weekend if you haven't done so already. Gonna have to peel the temp registration from the windshield and make a copy of it to send with your rebate application.

cwcabuhat - suggest you ask the dealer to make you an extra copy of the temp registration before they stick it to your windshield.

 

[jdmsti101]

Just got a quote from one of the dealership and I got $1,2500 due at singing and $247 including tax for 36 month with 12k miles/year....does it sound a good deal? I have never lease a vehicle before and not too sure what to watch out for when singing. Should I even consider a gap insurance and the excessive wear and tear plan?

 

[v_traveller]

Just got a quote from one of the dealership and I got $1,2500 due at singing and $247 including tax for 36 month with 12k miles/year....does it sound a good deal? I have never lease a vehicle before and not too sure what to watch out for when singing. Should I even consider a gap insurance and the excessive wear and tear plan?

You mean $1250 at signing, correct? If that's the case, your 3-year total out of pocket would be $1250 + $247 * 35 = $9895. That's a really good deal; for comparison, you can sift through this thread to see what others have gotten. What options are on the car?

Gap insurance: Risk on this lease is no worse than a low-down loan on a purchase. Which is why I skip it.
Wear and Tear Plan: I skip this one too since I typically fix anything that happens to my cars anyway, own or lease.

 

[WattsUp]

Gap insurance: Risk on this lease is no worse than a low-down loan on a purchase. Which is why I skip it.
Wear and Tear Plan: I skip this one too since I typically fix anything that happens to my cars anyway, own or lease.

Yup, these are like the "protection plans" they try to sell on the way out of Best Buy. Given that most electronics rarely break, you begin to understand why they push the plans so hard... they make gobs of money on them since they represent very expensive insurance.

Same at the car dealer. Skip them.

 

[jdmsti101]

Just got a quote from one of the dealership and I got $1,2500 due at singing and $247 including tax for 36 month with 12k miles/year....does it sound a good deal? I have never lease a vehicle before and not too sure what to watch out for when singing. Should I even consider a gap insurance and the excessive wear and tear plan?

You mean $1250 at signing, correct? If that's the case, your 3-year total out of pocket would be $1250 + $247 * 35 = $9895. That's a really good deal; for comparison, you can sift through this thread to see what others have gotten. What options are on the car?

Gap insurance: Risk on this lease is no worse than a low-down loan on a purchase. Which is why I skip it.
Wear and Tear Plan: I skip this one too since I typically fix anything that happens to my cars anyway, own or lease.

Yeah, I meant $1250 due at signing...got a fat finger. It has leather seats package with any base color I pick. The MSRP is $36999.

I think I will just skip both of the insurance/protection plans.

 

[v_traveller]

Wow, with leather makes this a great deal! Keep us posted... Is this in the So Cal area?