Impressions after 2 weeks of ownership

hybridbear said:

I'm surprised how many ppl have removed the organizer. We have all sorts of stuff inside it and find that having it in there and a flat load floor is much more useful than not having it in there. But we must be hauling different types of cargo...

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Ours has been in and out depending on what I need to haul. Most recently, though, its out. I'm keeping it around, though, so I can return it with the car at the end of the lease.

Keith -

Thanks for your two-week report!

My FFE was scheduled to be built two days ago, so I'm in the hanging-by-my-thumbs-excited-and-waiting stage. The Turbocord arrived on Saturday and my neighbor Russ will be putting in my 220 line in a day or two, so I'm ready to go.

Like so many others, the cargo organizer will come out of the car as soon as I get it home. As jmueller indicated, I'll just store it away until the lease is up.

My question is, how rapidly will the EV technology advance between now and June 2018?

zebracadabra said:

My question is, how rapidly will the EV technology advance between now and June 2018?

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The next big EV tech advance planned for within the next 3 years will be the release of higher capacity battery cars, allowing up to about 200mile range vs the current 70mile range, from manufacturers such as Chevy and possibly Ford.

campfamily said:

The electric consumption for my first drives is about where I was expecting. My commute is about 55 miles round trip each day. In the morning, it is primarily highway driving with little traffic; typical speed is about 75 to 80 mph. Coming home, I am in heavy stop and go traffic for about 10 to 15 miles, the rest of the drive is about 50 to 60 mph. When I get home, I have about 30 miles remaining on the Guess-o-Meter.

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That must be some flat stretch of highway you got there... I drive 55 miles round trip also with cruise control at 65mph I end up with about 30-40% left depending on traffic (or lack of it), the more traffic the less power I use. I have a fairly hilly commute too so it tends to give and take, mostly take.

So my car went over 1,000 miles this morning on the way to work, exactly 4 weeks after I bought the car. And, I have to say, my impressions of the car (see original post) haven't changed. I've experienced the dreaded wheel hop under braking over bumps a couple of times, but now I know to anticipate it. My 19 year old son is home from college, and I got the thumbs up from him. His girlfriend drives a new Prius C, and the FFE is so far superior it isn't even funny, and for about $7,000 less money. So far, the FFE has met every driving condition I've thrown at it, which is primarily my round-trip work commute (about 55 miles total), and odd trips around town during the evening and weekend. I'm averaging about 230 Wh/mile. I've confirmed what others on this forum have said about elevation; my house is about 975 feet, where I leave the car is closer to sea level. My energy consumption is much higher going home than going to work. I'm not driving the car any different than I would drive my ICE car; in other words, I'm not drafting semi trucks, or poking along at 60 mph. If traffic is moving at 75, then so am I. I have modified my braking a bit, I do a lot more coasting up to stops, when I can do it without ticking off the people behind me.

So far, 100% satisfied with my purchase. Would do it again in a heartbeat.

Keith

Pics to follow. In garage right now charging.

First impressions:

*pickup = wow

*brakes = wow

*is there anything better than watching miles remaining go from 47 to 48?

*8 butterflies look very pretty

*80% power returned, then 91% power returned, then 100% power returned = pretty awesome

*driving for 12 minutes on the parkway and miles remaining do not budge!

This car handles quite well. I'm so happy right now. My wife keeps harping on whether this was the right decision, well, it was for me.

zebracadabra said:

*80% power returned, then 91% power returned, then 100% power returned = pretty awesome

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Don't misread the % regen value: 100% means that you've regenerated as much as the car is going to let you regenerate. It does not mean that you've regenerated 100% of the power used to accelerate.

Its more something like this: The car can regen at most a 60kW rate. If you happen to hit that 60kW rate while you're braking it will give you 100%.

jmueller065 said:

Its more something like this: The car can regen at most a 60kW rate. If you happen to hit that 60kW rate while you're braking it will give you 100%.

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I don't think it's quite like either.

It is possible to achieve braking score of 100% when slowing from a slower speed like 25 mph or a higher speed like 85 mph. While it might be possible to hit maximum regen rate of 60 kW slowing from 85... it probably never happens from 25.

All we really know is that the car uses "some formula" to determine if you braked slowly and steadily enough to capture "all the energy possible" for that braking session. If so, the score will be 100%. We don't know exactly what the formula is, though. We also know (from experience) that braking quickly or abruptly enough to engage the friction brakes will definitely curtain the braking score.

Finally, remember the percentage shown by the Brake Coach is, after all, just a "score" -- and not any kind of measurement of energy or power. That said, consistently achieving high braking scores will be good for your energy efficiency.

Whatever the explanation is, I was only trying to convey my satisfaction that I was seeing immediate improvement from adjusting my driving style, like getting from zero to 8 butterflies (I finished the day with 6).

It's finally hitting me that I will not be stopping for gas anytime soon. Now I have to drop by the local Forest City neighborhood station though to thank Stanley, who has pumped gas for me for so many years. He's a really sweet guy and always carries around a smile and some good words.

Other than that, there are no drawbacks with my FFE.

zebracadabra said:

Whatever the explanation is, I was only trying to convey my satisfaction that I was seeing immediate improvement from adjusting my driving style, like getting from zero to 8 butterflies (I finished the day with 6).

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The butterflies are simply an artistic reflection of your current "status number". For example, if you have a status of +8, then you will see 8 butterflies.

I believe there is some upper limit of butterflies that will be displayed, maybe 10? Not sure of the upper limit... I turned the butterfly display off long ago. You can switch the right-hand dash display to a more "technical" display of your status, where the status is displayed as a graph. There is no real upper limit for that display.

Btw, the status number (and butterfly count) is simply the difference between the miles budgeted by the car when you turned in on (minus the actual distance driven so far) and the remaining range currently estimated.

Thus, drive more efficiently than the car had budgeted, and the status number will go up... possibly becoming positive. A positive status makes butterflies show up (in equal number). Drive less efficiently that the car budgeted, and the status number will go down... possibly becoming negative. There are never any butterflies shown with a negative status.

And, of course, drive exactly as efficiently as the car budgeted, and your status will simply be zero (e.g., perfectly "on budget"). Ideally, the on-budget scenario starts to happen more often as your driving style becomes more consistent and the car's estimation becomes calibrated to it.

zebracadabra said:

Other than that, there are no drawbacks with my FFE.

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Most of us here feel the same way.

WattsUp said:

I don't think it's quite like either.

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Yeah I was trying to illustrate that it isn't 100% power and didn't come up with an effective example.

zebracadabra: Check out my blog, especially the many entries highlighted on the top right, they explain a lot about the car and what the dash is showing you.
http://jamiegeek.myevblog.com

100% Brake Score means you didn't use the brake pads other than when regen cuts out below about 7 MPH. 90% brake score means than 10% of the potential electrical energy was wasted as heat by the brake pads. Not all 100% brake scores are created equal. Two braking events from 60 MPH to 0 MPH may both return a 100% brake score but with different amounts of energy put into the HVB.

I've been looking at Jamie's blog for a few days. A veritable wealth of information for the new FFE owner. Thanks, Jamie!

http://jamiegeek.myevblog.com/

I'm up to 88 mile range after charging. My scores have been pretty good and I'm aiming for 100 at some point. Not risking the trip to the Holbrook Country Club tomorrow though. Listed at 80.4 miles round trip and even though I'm showing an 88 mile range, I've only had the car a few days and I think I should start with maybe a 65-70 mile round trip journey first.

I typically took the Camry Hybrid to under 100 "miles remaining" but range anxiety is just not possible in an ICE.

zebracadabra said:

I'm up to 88 mile range after charging. My scores have been pretty good and I'm aiming for 100 at some point. Not risking the trip to the Holbrook Country Club tomorrow though. Listed at 80.4 miles round trip and even though I'm showing an 88 mile range, I've only had the car a few days and I think I should start with maybe a 65-70 mile round trip journey first.

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The miles shown after charging (or whenever you turn the car on) is just an estimate. It has no effect on the actual distance you can travel.

Regardless of your latest estimate, I would say a "confident" range for the FFE when the bulk of the trip will be freeway speeds on level ground is probably 70 miles. If you were going to drive, say, no higher than 50 mph (again, on level ground) you could probably be confident that you could make 80 miles. Change any parameter (hills, even a slow increase in elevation, or running the heater, etc.) and all bets are off. You could end up 10, even 20 miles, short.

But, yes, try some "less anxious" long-distance trips first (50 miles, etc.). Also, practice using the navi and learning how the "surplus" number works. The surplus number will be your friend during "max battery" trips.

Also, the only real things that govern whether you can make it a certain distance are 1) the energy in your battery and 2) your rate of consumption. With an average FFE full charge of (under ideal circumstances) 19 kWh or so, travelling 80 miles would mean a rate of consumption of 237 Wh/mi (19000 / 80 = 237) or less. Note that this rate is significantly lower than the average most people are able to achieve with "normal" driving patterns (which is more like 260 Wh/mi).

WattsUp said:

Also, the only real things that govern whether you can make it a certain distance are 1) the energy in your battery and 2) your rate of consumption. With an average FFE full charge of (under ideal circumstances) 19 kWh or so, travelling 80 miles would mean a rate of consumption of 237 Wh/mi (19000 / 80 = 237) or less. Note that this rate is significantly lower than the average most people are able to achieve with "normal" driving patterns (which is more like 260 Wh/mi).

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I still don't understand how so many of you have such high consumption! Our Lifetime Wh/mi is 240. We will hit 1 year with the FFE on Friday. This includes driving in MN winter. The Lifetime Wh/mi peaked at 249 toward the end of winter & has now been decreasing. We do trips all the time that involve highway driving and usually get around 230-240 Wh/mi. City only trips are usually 175-210 Wh/mi.

hybridbear said:

We do trips all the time that involve highway driving and usually get around 230-240 Wh/mi. City only trips are usually 175-210 Wh/mi.

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Are you saying your Wh/mi while on the highway is only 240 Wh/mi or less? (Not the average, I mean the "instantaneous" Wh/mi measurement shown on the energy meter as you drive.)

If so, I do not know how you do that. :? Unless by "highway driving" you're not referring to particularly fast speeds. For me, anything in the realm 65-75 mph means something like an instantaneous Wh/mi of 300 shown on the energy meter.

How fast do you drive on the highway? What is the PSI in your tires?

Also, regarding your average Wh/mi, what is the split between your "highway driving" (65 mph and above) versus your "slower driving" (45 mph and below)? If you do a lot more slower driving than highway driving, that could explain your low average Wh/mi.

WattsUp said:

hybridbear said:

We do trips all the time that involve highway driving and usually get around 230-240 Wh/mi. City only trips are usually 175-210 Wh/mi.

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Are you saying your Wh/mi while on the highway is only 240 Wh/mi or less? (Not the average, I mean the "instantaneous" Wh/mi measurement shown on the energy meter as you drive.)

If so, I do not know how you do that. :? Unless by "highway driving" you're not referring to particularly fast speeds. For me, anything in the realm 65-75 mph means something like an instantaneous Wh/mi of 300 shown on the energy meter.

How fast do you drive on the highway? What is the PSI in your tires?

Also, regarding your average Wh/mi, what is the split between your "highway driving" (65 mph and above) versus your "slower driving" (45 mph and below)? If you do a lot more slower driving than highway driving, that could explain your low average Wh/mi.

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I'm talking about trip Wh/mi, not instantaneous. There are too many variables that impact the instantaneous display. We also never drive above 65 MPH because that's the max speed limit on the freeways within range for the Focus Electric, most freeways we use are 55 MPH speed limit so we drive around 57 MPH or so. The cops around here will give you a ticket for 5 MPH over so you have to watch your speed carefully. Our tires have 44 PSI.

Hmmm, another question arises. What is the best suggestion for tire pressure from forum members?

hybridbear said:

I'm talking about trip Wh/mi, not instantaneous. There are too many variables that impact the instantaneous display. We also never drive above 65 MPH because that's the max speed limit on the freeways within range for the Focus Electric, most freeways we use are 55 MPH speed limit so we drive around 57 MPH or so.

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That is why your Wh/mi is so low. Around here on the freeway if you're not doing 70mph+ you're getting run off the road.

If I take only the side roads (max speed 45 mph) I can get as low as you're getting on a charge (usually if I've only used side-roads the day before I wake up to 100+ on the GOM after the overnight charge).

Another factor is if your area has a lot of hills or not. Flat terrain will give better efficiency.
My house is on top of a hill and the terrain in my county is very hilly so when I drive 25miles or so (50miles round trip) I experience a lot of elevation changes which will increase the overall wH/m used.
I have been using higher tire pressure (42-45psi) and that helps a little bit and with careful drive keeping freeway speeds to mostly 60-65mph (rarely 70-75mph only if going downhill for some freeway stretches) I've managed to get my average with mostly freeway driving down to ~270Wh/m overall.
I can get close under 250Wh/m for a 1-way trip leaving my house since its mostly downhill, but I pay for it when I drive back home.

This is giving me GOM full charge ranges of 77-82miles so I figure thats doing pretty good for my hilly area and mostly freeway driving.
Of course driving freeway during a slow rush hour period with stop&go driving I can get temporary higher range estimates nearing 100 miles, but I know thats just a temporary thing.