Brake lights inoperative when vehicle is off

Has anyone else noticed that their brake lights are inoperative when the FFE is off? Do the gas Focuses (Focii) work this way? Our Fusion Energi will turn on the brake lights any time you press the pedal, even when the car is turned off. If we park the Focus Electric and turn off the car while stepping on the brake the lights turn off with the car. If we're stepping on the brake before starting the car the brake lights don't come on until we start the car. This seems like very odd and potentially unsafe behavior to not have operating brake lights when the car is off.

I've noticed that it doesn't engage the brakes if the car is off. Unlike any other ICE car I've driven.

Try this: put it in neutral and turn it off with your foot on the brakes--the car will roll. You'll have to use the e-brake to stop it from rolling. I'm guessing that this has to do with the regen brakes.

Perhaps these two behaviors are related.

hybridbear said:

This seems like very odd and potentially unsafe behavior to not have operating brake lights when the car is off.

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Uh... why?

jmueller065 said:

I've noticed that it doesn't engage the brakes if the car is off.

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No true. The brakes will engage with the car off, you just have to press a lot harder on the pedal as the power assist is gone.

Also, this has nothing to do with regenerative braking (that's through the electric motor, not the mechanical brakes).

And this phenomenon is not specific to EVs. In any car with power assisted brakes (virtually every modern car), greater pedal pressure is required when the car is off.

WattsUp said:

No true. The brakes will engage with the car off, you just have to press a lot harder on the pedal as the power assist is gone.

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I understand that; I was pretty much standing on the brakes and the car was rolling freely.

Note that this is with the car in neutral. The reason I was thinking it has to do with regen is that when driving you can hit the brakes and they don't engage (due to regen) so thus there are circumstances where pressing the brakes doesn't engage the pads. With the car off I must have found a state where the pads were disengaged...

WattsUp said:

hybridbear said:

This seems like very odd and potentially unsafe behavior to not have operating brake lights when the car is off.

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Uh... why?

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Being visible while parked. I often keep my foot on the brake when I'm sitting in the car while parked on the side of the road to be more visible to traffic, particularly in low light conditions.

hybridbear said:

WattsUp said:

hybridbear said:

This seems like very odd and potentially unsafe behavior to not have operating brake lights when the car is off.

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Uh... why?

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Being visible while parked. I often keep my foot on the brake when I'm sitting in the car while parked on the side of the road to be more visible to traffic, particularly in low light conditions.

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Or, you could use the flashers... I can see where in certain circumstances it would be beneficial to have brake lights when the motor is off, but for me, I don't really worry about it, I have the flashers if that were to be the need.

Rogerschro said:

hybridbear said:

WattsUp said:

Uh... why?

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Being visible while parked. I often keep my foot on the brake when I'm sitting in the car while parked on the side of the road to be more visible to traffic, particularly in low light conditions.

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Or, you could use the flashers... I can see where in certain circumstances it would be beneficial to have brake lights when the motor is off, but for me, I don't really worry about it, I have the flashers if that were to be the need.

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It just doesn't make sense to me. I've never before seen a car where the brake lights are inoperative when the ignition is off.

jmueller065 said:

WattsUp said:

No true. The brakes will engage with the car off, you just have to press a lot harder on the pedal as the power assist is gone.

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I understand that; I was pretty much standing on the brakes and the car was rolling freely.

Note that this is with the car in neutral.

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Weird. That's exactly the test I did. I had to press harder, but the car stopped rolling. It didn't really seem to be any different than doing the same test in my gasser.