EV's may not be as green as we think

According to this AP story our EV's are not as environmentally friendly as we might think. I disagree but, read the article and you decide.

Ah Green Car Reports has it covered:
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1095936_new-study-doesnt-say-electric-cars-arent-green-headlines-to-the-contrary

Of course that report completely contradicts the report by Concerned Scientists (whoever they are) posted on the Sierra Club web site and here: http://www.ucsusa.org/clean_vehicle...harging-costs-electric-cars.html#.VJB6dTHF9ZA

Which one is correct, I could care less. I didn't buy the FFE for that reason, I bought it to reduce our dependency on foreign fuel.....and because I'm a geek.

frbill said:

According to this AP story our EV's are not as environmentally friendly as we might think. I disagree but, read the article and you decide.

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The story (beyond the stupid headline) really brings nothing new to the discussion. And the TRUE fact is that in most states of the nation, having an EV is better than owning any hybrid gasser.

Here is the actual map put out by the Union of Concerned Scientists that shows the emissions equivalence of an EV to a gas car in terms of MPG:

http://blog.ucsusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/EV-map21.jpg

With the accompanying article here:

http://blog.ucsusa.org/how-do-electric-cars-compare-with-gas-cars-656?_ga=1.217535638.1230707424.1415553089

Unfortunately politics have invaded all thought. The referenced article states that EV's "may not" be as green "as we think" has those equivocations while simultaneously being based upon the KoolAid drinking crowd's theories of "Deaths by Air Pollution" and Global Warming/Climate Change based upon Carbon Dioxide.

Setting aside the Carbon Dioxide argument and the claims of deaths by Air Pollution, we can all agree that urban air quality is an issue. By using electricity produced at power plants that are located in remote, rural areas, the urban air quality is improved versus the use of ICE. Period. No argument. Since "Air Pollution deaths", however quantified by the loonie activists, are located in urban areas where air quality is a genuine health concern, and the fact that the vast majority of electric car miles are in urban areas, the obvious conclusion is that the EV trend is decreasing the number of "Air Pollution deaths".

For the non KoolAid drinking crowd such as me, the reasons for driving an EV are geek related, efficiency related, cost related, maintenance freedom related, quiet ride related, oil independence related, and our desire to try out everything at least once.

Full disclosure. I am an engineer who owns a hopped up Corvette convertible, two SUVs, an Audi A8L, two fire trucks, two four wheelers, a boat and nine motorcyles. I am no activist, but we are all environmentalists. I do like toys including my electric car.

Electric cars never spill gas, leak oil, there energy supply does not required shipping across oceans, etc.

Anyone that even implies that an electric vehicle is not as green as ICE is just plain goofy.

This article from Inside EVs also takes the report to task, and others:
http://insideevs.com/ev-almost-always-greener/

Interesting is this statement:

So we are not sure why the university chose 2007 and only one future model. It is worth noting that the US saw its peak consumption of coal in 2007.

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Looks to me like the 2007 year was cherry picked because it was the peak coal consumption year (showing just a little bit of bias! sheesh).

I'm very disappointed in this report from my alma matter. But Minnesota is a pretty big coal state. The MN Twins stadium is built overtop of some train tracks where huge coal trains rumble along to feed the hungry coal power plants.

Another article arguing a similar story: http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2015/02/18/electric-car-benefits-air-myths-pollution-health-column/23641729/

hybridbear said:

Another article arguing a similar story: http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2015/02/18/electric-car-benefits-air-myths-pollution-health-column/23641729/

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That's a very strange article. My gut says they got it completely wrong. They missed all the CO2 from oil production, all those moving parts in an ICE, the oil changes, coolant, and manufacturing that is much more complex...

I don't know, that article just seemed like somebody wanted to make a big stink with no real backing.

A lot of these studies data have flaws in them. The data is no longer current, and doesn't reflect how power is generated on the grid today. Since the wide spread adoption of alternative fossil fuel extraction methods, we have seen adrop in fuel prices. This made natural gas a cheap supply of energy for generating electric power. So nateral gas has reduced the CO2 emision for electric power generation.

There's now a reply from UCS.