2012 FFE Brakes Grabbing Really Bad

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Rickgyver423

Member
Joined
Apr 19, 2014
Messages
8
The brakes on my 2012 FFE grab so suddenly that it's impossible to stop smoothly (and safely!). The brake pedal moves 2-3 inches before any noticable slowing occurs, then when the pedal moves another inch or so, the calipers literally cinch and the vehicle jerks to a stop. Anyone else experiencing this condition? It's done this ever since I bought the car (6 months ago) but it's getting worse and now my wife is afraid to drive it. (She's also threatening not to ride in it anymore because she's tired of being launched out of the passenger seat every time I hit the brakes.)
 
This is not normal. You've been driving this way for 6 months? :shock: Have you complained to the dealer?

You should start to feel slowing even just releasing the accelerator, as regeneration kicks in. The effect is more noticeable in L, but there is still some resistance in D (it's actually not really unlike in a conventional car when you let off the gas). When you press the brake, even slightly, you should start to feel more slowing right from the start.

Question: When you release the accelerator and/or start to brake, does the swirly "regeneration" animation appear over the battery gauge? If/when it does, you have no sense that the car is slowing during those times?
 
The car does have slightly grabby brakes if it has rained and we don't drive the car for a few days. But every car does that - the rotors tend to rust a little and they grab until that rust is gone.

Doesn't sound like that's the problem. Sounds a lot more serious, and a visit to the dealer, sooner than later is the best advice in the world.

One way to see if you are braking too hard - have the brake coach displayed on the left side of the instrument panel. If you are getting 100% recovered every single time and the car still jerks to a stop - get your dealer involved right away. If on the other hand, you see 75% recovered, you are mashing the pedal too hard. Use an open, empty area where you can gently squeeze the brake pedal and figure out what it takes to get 100%. Mashing the pedal too hard is really easy to do.

I started alternating between a lot of cars lately. What WattsUp mentions about slowing down when you take your foot off the accelerator is actually more pronounced than an ICE car (even in D) - when you drive them back to back.
 
Thanks WattsUp and EVA for your replies.

I was dealing with one Ford dealership who's service manager kept telling me "everything was normal," even though their mechanic recently told me on the sly that my brakes feel very "different" than other FFEs he's worked on and that something isn't right. Then, while driving on the freeway 2 weeks ago, I nearly lost control when the steering wheel jerked out of my hand during a hard, panic stop. I immediately called Ford Corporate and was instructed to take the car to another dealer, which I did the following day. It's now a week later and my car is still there; however, their service manager agrees that something isn't right and has vowed to fix the problem. For what it's worth, this past Friday I test drove a brand new 2014 FFE with the brake mechanic who's now working on my car, and we both agreed that my FFE's brakes are messed up. But Ford Corporate has refused to get involved (by sending a Ford engineer to inspect the vehicle) because of previous "everything normal" notes from the first dealership. Catch-22 anyone?

After extensive google searches, I'm starting to think this may have something to do with the mechanical back-up brakes kicking in too soon. When I stop the vehicle, the regen brakes work fine (95-100%) during coasting (in D & L) until I press the brake pedal past the "dead zone" and hit the spot where the calipers cinch, the front end drops and the car stops like it hit a concrete wall.

Anybody out there have any other ideas?
 
Ford apparently sent an engineer to the dealership to look at my car and he determined that the brakes are normal, even though the mechanic who worked on my car and the Service Manager continue to tell me they disagree and that something is definitely wrong.

If anyone out there has any ideas of what to do next, I'm all ears. Short of suing Ford, I have no where else to turn.
 
Rickgyver423 said:
If anyone out there has any ideas of what to do next, I'm all ears. Short of suing Ford, I have no where else to turn.
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My suggestion would be to ask to meet with the Ford regional representative at the dealership. Take a ride with him in your car and ask him for advice on how to stop the car. Even let him drive. At this point, I think Ford will get the message that the car doesn't operate right.
 
I agree with what Watts Up was suggesting....it goes straight into mechanical braking without the electric braking for moderate stops.

Can you fairly easily accomplish 100% or nearly so recovered energy stops? Can you go down a long steep hill with moderate brake application controlling your speed and see the battery percentage increase? A normal car can do so. If not, there's no electrical braking stage.

The brakes are a little more touchy than some cars, but it's the kind of thing you get used to in a few minutes, nothing extreme.
 
I'm able to get 100% braking regen, so I'm pretty sure that part is working properly. What's not normal is the 3" of play in the brake pedal where absolutely no braking occurs. Then when the brake is pressed another 1/2" the wheels literally lock and the car screeches to a halt. The brakes feel like they're either on or off; gradual stopping with this car is practically impossible.

Is there an mechanical, emergency backup system that could be kicking in too early? That's what it feels like. Like someone is pulling up hard on the emergency brake handle.

Ford Corporate tells me this is normal; the mechanic and service manager at my dealership tells me it's not and that something is definitely wrong.
 
Rickgyver423 said:
I'm able to get 100% braking regen, so I'm pretty sure that part is working properly. What's not normal is the 3" of play in the brake pedal where absolutely no braking occurs. Then when the brake is pressed another 1/2" the wheels literally lock and the car screeches to a halt. The brakes feel like they're either on or off; gradual stopping with this car is practically impossible.
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Achieving a 100% score from the Braking Coach regen requires a slow, gradual controlled braking.

While I don't doubt your story, how are you accomplishing this (100% score) if the brakes "don't brake" for 3 inches of pedal movement and then suddenly screech the car to a halt after 3.5 inches? The display might say 100% regen, but it doesn't seem (based on your description of what the car is doing) that the score could possibly be accurate. Or, can you actually achieve a slow, controlled braking with that last 1/2 inch of pedal movement? (But it's just very difficult?)

Either way, something is very wrong with the brakes. You should push your dealer and/or Ford to look into things further. I agree that you should try to find more FFEs to compare with.
 
The regen seems to work fine but the car doesn't stop until the brake pedal is pressed past the 2-3 inches of "dead" pedal travel, then the brakes jam on. Imagine the brakes being "on" or "off" only with no gradual build-up. That's the sensation. You press the pedal and nothing happens until the pedal gets to a certain point, at which time the calipers seem to lock down on the rotors. There is also a clunking sound at one or more of the wheels when the brake pedal is pressed. I've driven a number of other FFEs and none has this problem. In fact, I've never seen it before on any car. Two Ford technicians (at two different dealerships) agree that something is wrong, while Ford corporate says it's different than other FFEs, but still normal.
 
OK, Ricky this isn't super complicated. You have two dealerships that say something is wrong. Have them fix it. It makes no difference what somebody from Ford said or didn't say, the service people at the dealership say something is wrong - tell them to fix it. Leave your car until they fix it.

If that was an ICE, what you describe is a lot like air in the brake lines.

But it isn't your job to tell the service department what to do. They need to fix the brakes.

Seriously - you go back to pick up the car. The service guy says, well we can't fix your brakes, an Engineer from Ford was just here and he thinks your car is normal. We don't think it's normal and there is something wrong. Here's your car back, see ya, bye.

What's wrong with that picture? Before the see ya bye, turn it around - well fix the car if there is something wrong.

And you got the same answer from two different dealers? They both happened to have a Ford Engineer at their dealerships?
 
First dealership service manager told me brakes were normal. I disagreed and called Ford, who told me to take it to another dealership for a 2nd opinion. Second dealership service manager and technician told me brakes are not normal. Ford says they sent an engineer who felt they were a little different than other FFEs, but still within normal range. Service manager now says his hands are tied, he's been told by Ford that there is no brake repair to be made; Ford now saying to come and get the car off their dealer's lot. I'm stuck in the middle with 2 different stories.
 
Rickgyver423 said:
First dealership service manager told me brakes were normal. I disagreed and called Ford, who told me to take it to another dealership for a 2nd opinion. Second dealership service manager and technician told me brakes are not normal. Ford says they sent an engineer who felt they were a little different than other FFEs, but still within normal range. Service manager now says his hands are tied, he's been told by Ford that there is no brake repair to be made; Ford now saying to come and get the car off their dealer's lot. I'm stuck in the middle with 2 different stories.
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Have you gotten Ford Service involved? You can contact them on Facebook or Twitter. They can escalate your issue to the regional CSM. What happened when the Ford engineer drove your car? Was he able to stop smoothly? I'd ask to ride with him and have him show you what you're doing wrong. I'm not saying that you're doing something wrong, but if he claims the car is fine then he's implying that you're at fault.
 
"I agree that you should try to find more FFEs to compare with."

Finding another FFE around here would be like looking for chicken teeth.
Hoping I don't have to deal with issues like this one when mine comes in.


Zurc.
 
Unfortunately, Ford has elected to handle this issue in typical "domestic car" fashion, denying there is a problem (even though several Ford mechanics and at least one Ford Service Manager agree there is). I wrote a letter to Ford's CEO, only to get a reply from a lowly Ford Customer Service Rep telling me that Ford Motor Company "stands behind its original decision not to get involved in this matter."

For what it's worth, in 2003 I purchased a Toyota 4Runner that came with a faulty (leaky) sunroof that Toyota couldn't seem to repair. (The glass didn't seal right when closed.) I was prepared to “live with the problem; then, almost 2 years after the issue had first presented itself, I received a letter from Toyota asking me if my sunroof was still leaking, and if so, instructing me to take it to my nearest Toyota dealer for a newly discovered "fix." Toyota replaced my entire 2003 sunroof with their new 2005 version -- at no charge! -- and without me even having to ask! I still have that 4Runner after 10 years and my only expenses have been for gasoline, oil and tires! It is, hands-down, the best vehicle I've ever owned ... and, more importantly, the best ownership experience, as well. I'm now waiting for the next generation Rav4 Electric, at which time I plan to "dump" the Ford Focus -- and Ford! -- and switch back to a car and car company that stands behind its products and doesn't discredit its customer base to avoid having to do "the right thing."

I'm done with Ford, whose new slogan, in my opinion, should be changed from “Go Further” to “Go Figure.”
 
Rickgyver423 said:
Unfortunately, Ford has elected to handle this issue in typical "domestic car" fashion, denying there is a problem (even though several Ford mechanics and at least one Ford Service Manager agree there is). I wrote a letter to Ford's CEO, only to get a reply from a lowly Ford Customer Service Rep telling me that Ford Motor Company "stands behind its original decision not to get involved in this matter."

For what it's worth, in 2003 I purchased a Toyota 4Runner that came with a faulty (leaky) sunroof that Toyota couldn't seem to repair. (The glass didn't seal right when closed.) I was prepared to “live with the problem; then, almost 2 years after the issue had first presented itself, I received a letter from Toyota asking me if my sunroof was still leaking, and if so, instructing me to take it to my nearest Toyota dealer for a newly discovered "fix." Toyota replaced my entire 2003 sunroof with their new 2005 version -- at no charge! -- and without me even having to ask! I still have that 4Runner after 10 years and my only expenses have been for gasoline, oil and tires! It is, hands-down, the best vehicle I've ever owned ... and, more importantly, the best ownership experience, as well. I'm now waiting for the next generation Rav4 Electric, at which time I plan to "dump" the Ford Focus -- and Ford! -- and switch back to a car and car company that stands behind its products and doesn't discredit its customer base to avoid having to do "the right thing."

I'm done with Ford, whose new slogan, in my opinion, should be changed from “Go Further” to “Go Figure.”
Click to expand...
Have you filed a complaint with the NHTSA?
 
From day 1 I too have an identical occurrence, however my description is like a trolley sled under the rear wheels when coming to a stop feel like they are sliding on a rail...weird to describe. Deals says, don't do it for me'.
 

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