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electrons

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2016
Messages
141
Ever wondered? How big is this Ford Focus Electric thing anyway? (In the United States)
How do historical sales compare to Nissan Leaf, Tesla ModelS, etc.?

I looked up what I could and got:

Total Sales as of Dec. 2015:
410,000 plug-in cars of all kinds sold in the U.S. (since the Tesla Roadster launch in 2008);
5,977 Ford Focus Electrics (FFE) sold; (+66 in Jan. 2016 alone)
89,591 Nissan Leafs sold; (+755 in Jan. 2016 alone)

http://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plug-in_electric_vehicles_in_the_United_States

I knew my FFE purchase in Nov. 2015 was rare, and I'm a bit surprised at how low our sales figures are. In the entire country, only about 2.5 FFE's are sold every day, and it's been that way kind of steady for 3 years now!

One advantage we have is that at least our low-volume car shares most body panels, window glass (stone chips!), etc. with the other worldwide high-volume Focuses (Foci?) out there. So we can get parts easily for the body. ......

The Ford Focus worldwide sells more than Toyota Corolla, the previous champ.
 
Yup and Ford has absolutely no interest in increasing those numbers at all (despite the fact that there is now a commercial for it--just saw it again last night). If you haven't seen it, here it is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmwaYYru7Ic

The commercial is new (late last year) before that there was nothing, bupkis, here in the US. At least in Europe they did have a really cool ad at one time:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdklVANhQj8
 
jmueller065 thanks for the commercials, never seen them!

Very funny Euro one (your 2nd one). I'm about to get an App for my phone that uses bluetooth signals from the OBD connector on the FFE to make Mustang V8 sounds as you drive! That's better than having a guy in your passenger seat spraying the inside of your window..... :roll: :mrgreen:

Interesting to learn the engineering and marketing of the FFE in the last few years.
I was lucky to find mine on the dealer lot, at the same time I was about to go to a Nissan dealership for a Leaf (3 months ago). The Leaf would have been fine too, yet I gave the nod to the only FFE available in my state (rare) due to the better handling/steering/braking of the FFE from the experts at http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/final-scoring-performance-data-and-complete-specs-page-8
 
electrons said:
Ever wondered? How big is this Ford Focus Electric thing anyway? [...]
Total Sales as of Dec. 2015:
5,977 Ford Focus Electrics (FFE) sold; (+66 in Jan. 2016 alone)
http://insideevs.com/monthly-plug-in-sales-scorecard/
It would be neat to get an estimate of number of FFE's that have had major problems
compared to total sold.
(We seem to read mostly about the troubled cars, but I believe most of them are good. Our 2 have been fine.)
Any thoughts /estimates??
 
JTCalif said:
It would be neat to get an estimate of number of FFE's that have had major problems
compared to total sold.
(We seem to read mostly about the troubled cars, but I believe most of them are good. Our 2 have been fine.)
Any thoughts /estimates??
In the early days of the SSN problem I had a spreadsheet where I tallied the people on here who had the SSN problem. I believe at the time that I had calculated something like 2% or 3% of the cars (I think just about 1000 were sold at that point) exhibited the SSN problem.

Since that has been fixed, and now Ford has done another SSN recall (the harness recall) I would suspect that the FFE's with issues are now down to <1%. Granted this is all speculation, however.
 
There's fun charts on this site to compare sales numbers: http://evcharts.com/charts/chart?vehicles[]=10&graphtype=vehicle&start_date=Dec 2014&end_date=Jan 2016&country=840&default=true

Here's the US only sales for the FFE
e9e78ae68c7bc69dae00188e669208fda0a7753ec551df61a8319c995145ca4c.png


(not sure why it's ugly, chart is nicer on the site)
 
I don't understand why anyone would buy a Leaf. I drove one and absolutely hated it. The Focus is not only a better engineered car when it comes to the technical aspects, but its a better looking and better priced car for the options. There are a few features the high end leaf has that I wish we had (or at least had options) but besides that the Focus wins in every way. The leaf has just had so much publicity... Not to mention all that trunk space!
 
marta said:
There's fun charts on this site to compare sales numbers: http://evcharts.com.
Interesting how all the business goals and market forces (price of gas!) combine to create the results.

jmueller065 said:
.In the early days of the SSN problem .
I didn't know about those early-ish problems. Looked it up and found Ford took over a year to solve it, outrageous. I think they said it was caused by software/hardware communication problems that cut off the lower big battery in the back.

Might add that the batteries and powertrain were out-sourced, all integrated by Ford of course though. Magna International makes the powertrain, and LG Chem makes the battery. It could be Ford caught Magna/LGChem dragging their feet when accused of a problem, contributing to delays in implementing a solution.

breeves002 said:
I don't understand why anyone would buy a Leaf. I drove one and absolutely hated it. .
Thats the way I viewed it too. I test drove a Leaf, and it wasn't awful, but the Focus is simply a better driving car. It would have required wringing the Leaf out on the road in extreme maneuvers to really test it, and I didn't do that myself. For years I've used Car and Driver magazine to shake 'em down in a full test. Focus came out on top of the Leaf in C&D's comparo test, helping me make the right choice.

Bought my Focus Elect about 3 months ago, and a Ford C-Max non-plugin hybrid 4 months ago, also a leader in ride/handling/steering, over the Prius competitor in the CMax's case. Prius just doesn't have a great driving experience. Nissan Leaf similar, Ford beats them both.
 
electrons said:
Looked it up and found Ford took over a year to solve it, outrageous.
Maybe, maybe not (outrageous). Think of it from Ford's point of view:
  • Brand new powertrain
  • Two different contractors
  • Everything is/was new to all of them
Sometimes problems are hard to find and mix in with that the pace that the OEM's move. Once they determined what the problem was, then they had to implement the fix, and then road test it. I'm sure the testing phase took the most time; especially given the nature of the error--how much testing is required for them to be confident that they solved the issue? one week? one month? six months? 100 miles? 1000 miles? I'm guessing it wasn't easy.

In addition, where do you measure the starting point at? "One year" from when? Ford first acknowledged the problem (from what I remember they never did--the only acknowledgment was the recall). One year from when Ford first started selling the FFE? I'm sure at that point they didn't know there was an issue (neither did all the hundreds of buyers).

I've worked on systems with spurious issues like the original SSN problem--they are a pain in the butt to diagnose and repair.
 
jmueller065 said:
.In addition, where do you measure the starting point at? "One year" from when? Ford first acknowledged the problem (from what I remember they never did--the only acknowledgment was the recall). One year from when Ford first started selling the FFE? I'm sure at that point they didn't know there was an issue (neither did all the hundreds of buyers)..

Ford was getting reports from the field even before it happened at http://insideevs.com/i-am-the-high-voltage-battery-killer/ in the Fall of 2012, reports coming in earlier than that by some amount.

The SSN problem was diagnosed and identified in the Fall of 2012 at the latest, then the NHTSA opened a 'frequent problem' issue ticket in late 2013, a year later, and then Ford had a forced recall solution in early 2014 (recall 13S09). Just going by the direct reporting from http://insideevs.com/focus-electrics-recalled-as-ford-finally-reacts-to-the-stop-safely-now-power-loss-problem/

Sounded like a Magna International problem with the software controlling their hardware.
 
breeves002 said:
I don't understand why anyone would buy a Leaf. I drove one and absolutely hated it. The Focus is not only a better engineered car when it comes to the technical aspects, but its a better looking and better priced car for the options. There are a few features the high end leaf has that I wish we had (or at least had options) but besides that the Focus wins in every way. The leaf has just had so much publicity... Not to mention all that trunk space!

Couldn't agree more. The Leaf wasn't worth $6000 more for less features than the Focus. Plus I doubt I would have gotten same the discount on a Leaf that I got on the Focus.
 
electrons said:
Sounded like a Magna International problem with the software controlling their hardware.
It was a bunch of modules getting out of sync with each other and when that happened the powertrain module would simply shut down because it lost contact with the BECM.
 
breeves002 said:
I don't understand why anyone would buy a Leaf. I drove one and absolutely hated it. The Focus is not only a better engineered car when it comes to the technical aspects, but its a better looking and better priced car for the options. There are a few features the high end leaf has that I wish we had (or at least had options) but besides that the Focus wins in every way. The leaf has just had so much publicity... Not to mention all that trunk space!

+1 I almost bought a leaf because Ford really didn't want to sell me a FFE. After taking a leaf for a test drive I was almost willing to buy one. My hangups were 1; the fugliness of the Leaf and 2; the stoopid chintzy feeling "gear" selector knob. At the time (2014) the leaf was thousands more especially after the 10/2014 price drop that conveniently occurred before I took delivery! I was already heavily leaning toward the FFE but the price I negotiated with the nissan dealer was still thousands more than the FFE.
 
triangles said:
breeves002 said:
I don't understand why anyone would buy a Leaf. I drove one and absolutely hated it. The Focus is not only a better engineered car when it comes to the technical aspects, but its a better looking and better priced car for the options. There are a few features the high end leaf has that I wish we had (or at least had options) but besides that the Focus wins in every way. The leaf has just had so much publicity... Not to mention all that trunk space!

+1 I almost bought a leaf because Ford really didn't want to sell me a FFE. After taking a leaf for a test drive I was almost willing to buy one. My hangups were 1; the fugliness of the Leaf and 2; the stoopid chintzy feeling "gear" selector knob. At the time (2014) the leaf was thousands more especially after the 10/2014 price drop that conveniently occurred before I took delivery! I was already heavily leaning toward the FFE but the price I negotiated with the nissan dealer was still thousands more than the FFE.


I test drove a leaf before testing the FFE. It wasn't terrible to drive but it had a weird look and feel to it. And much more expensive.
 
Comment on the low number of FFEs sold to date.

This is a bit embarrassing but when I first looked into buying an EV I didn't even realize Ford made an EV. It was only after I tested a LEAF and felt mildly dissatisfied that I began to look at what was really out there. The FFE had nice styling and I loved the way it drove. Still, I have yet to see another FFE other than a dealer lot. Hope that changes over time.
 
Wishful thinking: Ford is secretly developing an even better EV, with improved range, to reveal about with Chevy's new one.
Suspicion: they are happy to go on making popular pickup trucks et al. instead (at least while gasoline is sort of cheap).
 
JTCalif said:
Wishful thinking: Ford is secretly developing an even better EV, with improved range, to reveal about with Chevy's new one.
Suspicion: they are happy to go on making popular pickup trucks et al. instead (at least while gasoline is sort of cheap).

I've been deluding myself with that same dream...the 200 mile Fusion or Lincoln. Up to the last second I imagined Ford's big surprise at the Detroit Auto Show would be something like that. Nope...an "improved" truck
 
I wonder why Ford can't make an electric F150 or at least a hybrid. Isn't it made out of aluminum? The F150 is still popular and I would think some potential owners would jump at a change to boost mileage about the teens.
 
A friend suggested the idea of an electric pickup truck. I scoffed at the idea, but he explained that there are many in remote areas for whom a trip into town for gas is a long, time consuming trip. He said those people could use an electric pickup easily, chargings at home, and they would save money and a lot of time.

I'm not familiar with that sort of environment, but he says his family is from a farming background and it's true
 
michael said:
A friend suggested the idea of an electric pickup truck. I scoffed at the idea, but he explained that there are many in remote areas for whom a trip into town for gas is a long, time consuming trip. He said those people could use an electric pickup easily, chargings at home, and they would save money and a lot of time.

I'm not familiar with that sort of environment, but he says his family is from a farming background and it's true
Ford had an electric pickup:
Ford Ranger EV
ElectricFordRanger.jpg
 
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